Discussion Do you think that gaming is slowly healing? Or that gaming is getting worse?

[Alys]

With all the news of shitty companies shutting down from lack of sales, and then more companies being exposed of doing terrible localization or censoring their games, do you think that gaming is slowly healing from the terrible localization/censorship disaster? Or that it's getting worse and worse with no end in sight?

 

[Narmy]

I won't believe it's healing until they get rid of the body type bullshit in character creators. Also gachashit is another huge problem facing gaming that has yet to be really fought.

 

[PhantomXero1x]

Far from healing honestly still way too many schizo wokies from the fandoms to the development studios.

 

[JX475]

I voted in between which is still sad regardless because the standard should be that we are healing. Square Enix gives me hope as do smaller Japanese Indies popping up. But it's not a lot of the industry. We have a dual problem here.

In the West everything is about Graphics, at the expense of game design, good art direction and fanservice that used to occasionally exist. Because of that all of these Western Audiences have moved to Japanese stuff, buy it, play it for a few days and talk about it for a few weeks and then never touch it again on social media. These are the people being listened to than the core audience who has been around since the beginning. This has caused friction with Translators that hate the culture because fanservice = bad, but can not get a job somewhere else, and think Japanese is awful as a whole. They do it for the paycheck and they know without that decent paycheck they would be out on the streets. They also never complain much about the pay compared to minimum wage workers.

In Japan they never went away from good art design, good gameplay on things they know how to do. But it's being compromised by middle people from the types of consulting agencies that say "you need to precensor X and Y before it can be released" AAA in Japan have also become too greedy and have become American companies and globalized for money and it's not a long term solution it is also not sustainable. It's a very short term thinking process. Because what happens when the hardcore audience leaves, and then your casual audiences who never liked your content go back to Western stuff? What happens when your Indies and AA's supplant you and do the things you used to do? You basically will have to start back from square one but at the hugest disadvantage ever.

Also Narmy brings up a good point about Gacha,GAAs to me Japanese AAA companies focuses so much of the AA studios it owns on gacha that is just sad. They are wasting away their talent on this. From Senran Kagura to Gundam all the way to whatever random mega franchise. Fans are to blame for this because they keep up the cycle to keep this bad genre going and not let the bubble pop. I am noticing they are getting desperate and putting Gacha on PC not realizing that people would like full games but it will change soon anyways.


Finally I will say that in order for me to have any real hope in gaming again AAA in Japan will need to

1. move to AI Translations with a Japanese person that knows English/Japanese as an editor.
2. Allow creative freedom to it's studios and stop pandering to Western audiences who do not care about your game. This is doing long lasting damage to your brand. You are Japanese, not a Western company, we like you because you are Japanese and we like your culture.
3. Fanservice needs to make a come back again

Until then I am going to buy from Japanese Indies and AA's, however I can and support fantl that is Uncensored due to how awful these translations are becoming. My AAA spending will be few and in between unless it's proven to not be messed with badly. Which is becoming more and more rare.

 

[Ebicentre]

We are on the cusp of what many believe to be another gaming crash, and I'm hoping it'll happen simply to wipe out the AAA industry. We also have more eyes than ever on consultancy firms like Sweet Baby Inc., to the point there might be another GamerGate (how appropriate for its tenth anniversary).

But until Japanese companies implement strict policies dictating the accuracy and integrity of their translations (especially English), I can't say things are finally better for us.

 

[PhantomXero1x]

We are on the cusp of what many believe to be another gaming crash, and I'm hoping it'll happen simply to wipe out the AAA industry. We also have more eyes than ever on consultancy firms like Sweet Baby Inc., to the point there might be another GamerGate (how appropriate for its tenth anniversary).

But until Japanese companies implement strict policies dictating the accuracy and integrity of their translations (especially English), I can't say things are finally better for us.

We're already here with both the crash and gamergate 2.0.

 

[Alys]

My thoughts are... also in between.

While I do think that gaming is going to get far worse before it gets better, I do see that things can, and likely will get better with how much pushback all of these terrible practices, localizers being terrible, and censorship in games and anime is getting.

I think things are going to get far, far worse before it gets better.
But at the same time, I feel I have more hope for it getting better than I ever did before.

 

[Ebicentre]

We're already here with both the crash and gamergate 2.0.

I'm not sure they're at the level we need it to be in order to count. Something like Ubisoft going tits up would be a real indicator of a crash.

 

[JX475]

We are on the cusp of what many believe to be another gaming crash, and I'm hoping it'll happen simply to wipe out the AAA industry. We also have more eyes than ever on consultancy firms like Sweet Baby Inc., to the point there might be another GamerGate (how appropriate for its tenth anniversary).

But until Japanese companies implement strict policies dictating the accuracy and integrity of their translations (especially English), I can't say things are finally better for us.

It's easy to think like that, but i do think it will need a large correction(loss of funds) to have that happen. I hate to say this, but the Western Industry needs to come back here, and Japan needs to get more people involved in the AA and Indie industry as a whole. The West needs to realize fanservice sells, smaller games are better and people like style and do not care about substance. Getting away from corrupt AAA and into AA/Indies will unironically help us out in the long term. Because the concentration of power is easy control for investors than it is for the AAA industry itself.

My thoughts are... also in between.

While I do think that gaming is going to get far worse before it gets better, I do see that things can, and likely will get better with how much pushback all of these terrible practices, localizers being terrible, and censorship in games and anime is getting.

I think things are going to get far, far worse before it gets better.
But at the same time, I feel I have more hope for it getting better than I ever did before.

I can agree, this is what i try to emphasize a lot. The pushback today is FAR stronger than it ever was before. When GG 1.0 happened, i remembered everyone falling for the "oh you silly anon, they are not coming for your games, it's just one game" "oh it's just some censorship, it happens", but when it has infected various forms of entertainment with politically correct things, censorship of fanservice, and you have to be careful of what you can and can not draw or make. More people began to notice it effected their own lives and their own fun i mean Sweet Baby Inc detector was made because LatinX was inserted into Spiderman 2 and gender neutral language which makes zero sense as a whole to Latin Americans, much like all Americans are experiencing it now. It also does not help that Japan is starting to get hurt by this as well because it's not only having to carry the entire Video Games industry on it's own, it's having to deal with Western translators who do not like Japanese stuff trying to precensor it before hand with consulting firms based on diversity and trying to organize the lynch mob online to silence dissent or push them into compliance.

My opinion is no different, it's going to be bad still, there will be some small ups and downs like always, but as long as we keep fighting and as long as we keep pushing back and taking away their funding, their entire narrative, we will win out and get the change we desire. It's easier now than it used to be. We just need to keep speaking out over it and pushback as a whole. I do believe it is changing so as long as we keep this up and keep pushing for things to be better and being vocal about it to where their opinions are drowned out.

 

[RaptorJesus]

At this point I'll take anything but the current paradigm of hiring people who hate your customers. I don't know quite how that became the norm, but here we are. A shift back to the mid-late 90's era of tons of medium-budget games as opposed to trying to make mass-market-appeal indistinguishable games would be great. I don't think we're necessarily heading there across the board, but Square-Enix seems to be going that way, even if it is a case of two steps forward, one step back with examples of (the same character no less) Tifa and Aeris's bikinis but at the same time going back and patching a sports bra onto Tifa retroactively in the previous title. I think we're slowly headed in a better direction, if only because it's easier than ever to get a product out with a small team and then get it to market. It wasn't insanely difficult for one person to program a game in the past, but to get it in front of customers? Much harder going through brick and mortar stores. But with Steam, Itch.io, Gog, etc there are so many avenues to get things to people who want them, so I expect we'll see a lot of stepping up to fill gaps in the market. For all the issues that can arise from scammers, Kickstarter, Indiegogo, etc have done great with being able to fund things that wouldn't otherwise have happened. Off the top of my head there's Divinity Original Sin, Pathfinder Kingmaker+Wrath of the Righteous, and even Subverse that have made been crowdfunded to create games large publishers wouldn't touch with a ten foot pole (Subverse in particular being an example of that). We're headed in the right direction, but it won't be smooth and there will be hiccups.

 

[ジエントＰ]

With all the news of shitty companies shutting down from lack of sales, and then more companies being exposed of doing terrible localization or censoring their games, do you think that gaming is slowly healing from the terrible localization/censorship disaster? Or that it's getting worse and worse with no end in sight?

I think it's going to be the rise of Indie development and english translation houses like kagura trying and failing to keep up. AAA has been a dead horse to me for a while and I've stopped playing A or AA game since last year. There's just something better and worst about a single person story writer and no editor.
There has to be a way to streamline the programming and delegating Art direction, Story, and Music to better equipped people than just one person winging it with free assets. Maybe 3-4 people at most on a game, more than that is a drag and a negative cost most likely. So In order for the scene to really explode the AAA industry needs to take the backseat longer and a collaborative platform needs to arise to really put a end to the AAA farce and the manipulative Investor/Shareholder Companies it associates with.
We need more stuff like Karyyns prison, but better somehow and more than the same few talented figures on the indie scene already. Not that I hate the Talented figures, I really love them, I just wantt a little more veriety.

 

[grapedApe]

Need a few more Stellar Blades making bank before I can believe it's healing.

 

[Lost Branch]

I think the gaming industry is right back where it was in the early 90s, but instead of millions of bootlegs, it's consultants and active government interference.

The current positive is that these companies have started feeling the effects of these choices. More and more people are getting fired as people continue to notice all the issues piling up. Sales are tanking and killing any possible profits from even big titles.

I forsee dev studios either collapsing or getting absorbed in the near future as these policies continue to be forced out.

 

[HYppog]

It's not healing until we get another period of PS2/PS3 era where devs are free to make and express themselves as they wish, cater to who they want without fear of reprisal, and sell games to niche group without trying to cash in the infinite growth bullshit.

Until I see something like Stella Glow get released on main platform and not as gacha trash again, this industry is irreparably corrupted and should be seen as moldy junk food.

 

[JX475]

I think it's going to be the rise of Indie development and english translation houses like kagura trying and failing to keep up. AAA has been a dead horse to me for a while and I've stopped playing A or AA game since last year. There's just something better and worst about a single person story writer and no editor.
There has to be a way to streamline the programming and delegating Art direction, Story, and Music to better equipped people than just one person winging it with free assets. Maybe 3-4 people at most on a game, more than that is a drag and a negative cost most likely. So In order for the scene to really explode the AAA industry needs to take the backseat longer and a collaborative platform needs to arise to really put a end to the AAA farce and the manipulative Investor/Shareholder Companies it associates with.
We need more stuff like Karyyns prison, but better somehow and more than the same few talented figures on the indie scene already. Not that I hate the Talented figures, I really love them, I just wantt a little more veriety.

Can you tell me more about Kagura Games studios? I did see they publish games and try to enact a uncensored policy than most. I can also agree that there just is not much overall currently in Indies because everyone is too busy chasing popular thing like Roguelikes than trying something new or even just experimenting in different genres.

I think the gaming industry is right back where it was in the early 90s, but instead of millions of bootlegs, it's consultants and active government interference.

The current positive is that these companies have started feeling the effects of these choices. More and more people are getting fired as people continue to notice all the issues piling up. Sales are tanking and killing any possible profits from even big titles.

I forsee dev studios either collapsing or getting absorbed in the near future as these policies continue to be forced out.

I think this will be the thing for normals who do not know how to make games. But at least we now know which games to avoid and the templates are. Even if they try to do sneaky bait and switches it will be too obvious.

It's not healing until we get another period of PS2/PS3 era where devs are free to make and express themselves as they wish, cater to who they want without fear of reprisal, and sell games to niche group without trying to cash in the infinite growth bullshit.

Until I see something like Stella Glow get released on main platform and not as gacha trash again, this industry is irreparably corrupted and should be seen as moldy junk food.

I have been hoping for the days like that. But the key thing is they exist, they just are not pushed to the front anymore because the industry is hyper obsessed with graphics and the whole growth thing. They are hitting a wall though and it's kind of obvious with studios trying to push for 70$ being the new price point and also Deluxe Editions going from 100$ to 120$. Customers are beginning to no longer pay for this and DLC. So companies are in trouble as a whole. The best thing we can do is push people to begin buying games from AA companies and Indies overall and shill these games so that way one day they can be able to rise up against these AAA's or even provide competition to change the industry. As for Fanservice like Stellar Blade, i do think we will begin seeing a return back to those games again once Stellar Blade releases in the West. It seems like Totoki is making a bet on this being the new direction for Sony.

 

[Narmy]

Can you tell me more about Kagura Games studios? I did see they publish games and try to enact a uncensored policy than most. I can also agree that there just is not much overall currently in Indies because everyone is too busy chasing popular thing like Roguelikes than trying something new or even just experimenting in different genres.

I am not a fan of Kagura Games because they favor the Chinese market. They use an offsite patch to uncensor their games so that they will not be flagged as adult-only on Steam, since porn is illegal in China and adult-only games don't show up on their version of Steam. But they won't use that same loophole to let you play the Japanese version uncensored.

 

[Rama]

It's worse than ever, who in their right mind think it's getting any better?

This is why the so called "left" is winning. They are fucking vindictive and will not stop until their opposition is totally deplatfomed or destroyed. SBI founder literally said she and her ilks wants to take over the industry. And for these crazies it means everything is run by diverse black/brown women of colors and shit. That's obviously not the case so they're not stopping now. Meanwhile the "right" or whatever takes solace in small "victories" like Stellar Blade and don't push further. If you think you can coexist with an enemy who outright says they want to erase you (gamers) then you're a fool.

I will not believe anything's better until we return to the former status quo at least. That means getting rid of all the DEI and Type 1/2 BS in games. Sexy and beautiful women in abundance, characters acting like they are written by competent writers and not diversity hires. Devs/publisher pushing companies like SBI out is no longer optional, it's a must if they want their precious industry to survive. Maybe then i'll believe things are getting better.

 

[Alys]

It's worse than ever, who in their right mind think it's getting any better?

This is why the so called "left" is winning. They are fucking vindictive and will not stop until their opposition is totally deplatfomed or destroyed. SBI founder literally said she and her ilks wants to take over the industry. And for these crazies it means everything is run by diverse black/brown women of colors and shit. That's obviously not the case so they're not stopping now. Meanwhile the "right" or whatever takes solace in small "victories" like Stellar Blade and don't push further. If you think you can coexist with an enemy who outright says they want to erase you (gamers) then you're a fool.

I will not believe anything's better until we return to the former status quo at least. That means getting rid of all the DEI and Type 1/2 BS in games. Sexy and beautiful women in abundance, characters acting like they are written by competent writers and not diversity hires. Devs/publisher pushing companies like SBI out is no longer optional, it's a must if they want their precious industry to survive. Maybe then i'll believe things are getting better.

Unfortunately this is true. While I do think it's eventually going to get better, not only will it not get better without people working for it to get better, it's also going to get way, wayyyyy worse before it even thinks to get better.

If people think we're in a gaming crash right now, it's going to get even more hellish soon. It's going to get baaaaaaad. Real bad. And until people do more about it, it'll be bad for a while.

I do think that eventually it will get better. But not without effort.

That being said, the right is pretty retarded too. So I'd rather not have this be a battle of left vs right, but gamers vs political nutjobs (most of which are leftist nutjob retards, that's for damn sure. Because the right can be retarded, but they got no backbone. Meanwhile the left is retarded but will do whatever the hell it takes to ruin shit for everyone else because they're unhappy.)

 

[Rama]

That being said, the right is pretty retarded too. So I'd rather not have this be a battle of left vs right, but gamers vs political nutjobs (most of which are leftist nutjob retards, that's for damn sure. Because the right can be retarded, but they got no backbone. Meanwhile the left is retarded but will do whatever the hell it takes to ruin shit for everyone else because they're unhappy.)

That's why i put left and right in quotes. Of course this is not about american left/right politics but i thought it was an appropriate comparison. And I know the right can be pretty retarded too. Didn't Matt Walsh (What is a Woman doc.) made a video about SBI recently? He wasn't shitting on sweet baby because he cares about what gamers think. He did because he thinks video games are for children and sweet baby is indoctrinating children though them. Something similar happened a few years ago and i got downvoted to hell on the Kotakuinaction subreddit for saying: Matt Walsh isn't exactly an ally guys, we just happen to have the same enemy right now. Like, the man think Anime is satanic for fcks sake.

 

[salty_apollyon]

With all the news of shitty companies shutting down from lack of sales, and then more companies being exposed of doing terrible localization or censoring their games, do you think that gaming is slowly healing from the terrible localization/censorship disaster? Or that it's getting worse and worse with no end in sight?

i think we are way past the point where any healing would be possible

the gaming industry is rotten to an almost 80% specially the big studios.
the best thing to do would be to let them rot away so something new can take their place.

crash and burn everything, leave no survivors and may god erase the plague we are currently facing