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Drama Platinum Games v.s. Hellena Taylor: Bayonetta 3, boycotts, nuance and questions

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Bayonetta's former English VA alleges she was offered way below the value she brought to the game

Ebicentre

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Original subtitle: 'Bayonetta's former English VA alleges she was only offered $4,000 to reprise the role'​


Hoo boy, this is a big story that has angered a lot of people, so I'll try my best to be succinct.

On the 15th of October, 2022, voice actress Hellena Taylor (famous for providing the voice for Bayonetta) posted a series of videos explaining why she did not reprise the role for Bayonetta 3. (Archive here.) In the videos, she accuses Platinum Games of not offering her enough money to play the character for the entire game: an alleged 'final offer' of $4,000 USD. As a result, she has demanded that fans of Bayonetta boycott the game and donate their money to charity instead. You can watch the full video below (reuploaded by someone else).


The fallout, as you would've guessed, was tremendous. And Hideki Kamiya is handling it about as well as you expect. He was blocking people so quickly and frequently that Twitter actually locked him out of his account for 'unusual activity'.

FfJ6VBDVEAEMX89

Here's what he's been saying in response to the Internet dogpiling him:

Sad and deplorable about the attitude of untruth. That's what all I can tell now. By the way, BEWARE OF MY RULES.

俺ツイッターマスターだから公式クライアントの使い方よく知らなくてTweetdeck使っててそっちだと@で来るツイート色々見れたんだけど今昆虫たちが押し寄せてきてるので公式クライアント使用に切り替えた...ら, I hardly see any @tweets. I've lost track of them, so please understand that I may not be able to reply for a while...

つーかそもそも公式クライアントだと@ツイートがほとんど届かないのなぜだろう...俺が使い方分かってないだけ...? (I'm not sure I'll be able to read your reply, so please leave it alone...)

But with the official client, there are few steps before blocking, so it's super comfortable... I wish Tweetdeck and Feather would learn from this...

(Please be careful, because blocking is super comfortable and you'll end up blocking irrelevant things too...)

I'll block a lot of things I don't understand because it's too easy to block...

I see... so this is an official way to do this...

I should block all the quoted retweets too... I can't stand reading them...

I warned you...

FfJg_H5VQAAinsr


When Platinum was interviewed by Game Informer about Taylor being replaced, they used the phrase 'overlapping circumstances'. I and several other people assumed this meant Taylor had prior engagements (i.e. she had a schedule conflict with another acting gig). But with this new context provided by Taylor, it's possible they meant to say 'various factors'. So either A) there's been a translation error; or B) Platinum just straight-up lied to us in a typical, indirect fashion the Japanese are famous for.

So this is where we are as I type this. Before I get into the nitty-gritty, I should say here that yes, I do believe $4,000 is ridiculous and way too low for a character like Bayonetta. At the same time however, I can separate that opinion from the rest of my thoughts. My goal here is to get ahead of the curve and offer some food for thought.

Is Bayonetta as successful as Taylor claims it is? Maybe. You have to remember the franchise was being shopped around for a while, until Nintendo bought the rights for the second game. A wildly successful franchise shouldn't have so much trouble finding a publisher. It's easy to see the number $450,000,000 and think, 'Wow, there's so much money just sitting there!'. And sure, you can make the argument that corporate suits receive way too big of a cut in sales (compared to the people who actually created the game [programmers, etc.]). But that's also a broader problem in creative industries as a whole, not just voice acting.

I'm also wondering what Taylor considers a 'living wage'. Does she just mean a higher pay-out (which is fine), or does she mean royalties (i.e. a percentage of continuous income after the fact)? Because if it's the latter, I'm afraid she has no leg to stand on. She claims Jennifer Hale (her replacement) does not have the 'right' to Bayonetta's voice (or to even sign merchandise!). 'I created that voice,' she stated. Well, the problem is, neither does she. Hellena Taylor does not own the character of Bayonetta - Nintendo, Sega and Platinum do. Nor does she own the concept of a sensual British accent. Actors earn royalties when their likeness is used in a product, usually a movie where their faces are on screen. As far as I know, there is no legal precedent on paying royalties for vocal performances, and likely there never will be. (And good luck trying to argue that in the Japanese legal system...)

Will her boycott work? No. The game has already been dubbed and it's almost release day. Even in the best-case scenario for Taylor, Nintendo will absolutely not delay the game to put her back in (see: their refusal to delay a Pokémon game for even one more year). Unless you have an audience of like ten people, boycotts will simply be ignored by companies in favour of their own interests. I can count on one hand how many times a boycott worked.

But let's tackle the elephant in the room, as this is the deciding factor over who's in the right. Hellena Taylor is a member of SAG-AFTRA, a voice actor union that tried (and failed) to negotiate higher wages (including royalty payments for each role), and requires all their talents to be fully vaccinated in order to work. I don't exactly have a favourable opinion of them. But here's the kicker: Jennifer Hale is also a member of SAG-AFTRA, and much more prolific. We can conclude that being a union member had no influence in this story (and if Taylor isn't a member, then she needs to remove SAG-AFTRA from her Twitter bio). So here are my questions:
  1. Was Jennifer Hale more expensive to hire than Hellena Taylor?
  2. What was the final offer that Hale took? Did she agree to $4,000?
  3. Did Hale and Taylor negotiate for more money?
  4. Was Taylor's offer truly final? Or was it the initial asking price?
  5. What was Taylor paid for Bayonetta 1 and 2?
If Hale was offered and took the $4,000, then yes, I agree Platinum/Nintendo are in the wrong. However, if Taylor merely believed the offer was final and didn't negotiate (or she didn't negotiate hard enough), then as much as I don't like it, there's nothing she can do. I don't think Kamiya hates Hellena Taylor (or at least, didn't) - she passed the audition without issue. But until Platinum consults their lawyers and issue an official response to the allegations, we can only speculate what happened behind the scenes.
 
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Deleted User

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Ignoring that Bayonetta 3 looks shit, the new dyke character is awful even in Japanese.
At least the Japanese performances are universally consistent like the english one so this isn't the big loss that Taylor is making it out to be, yuri lickmyballs always sounds shit, kindly rip your vocal chords out.
Do seiyuu even get royalties? If they do then they deserve it more than the union cunts in fag after.
 

Styner

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Worth noting but, that Hale's been liking tweets mentioning her and how it doesn't make sense money wise and that there's something more goining on that we don't know.

So there's three main characters...I'm starting to think there might not be that much bayo dialogue.
 

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Ebicentre

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Worth noting but, that Hale's been liking tweets mentioning her and how it doesn't make sense money wise and that there's something more goining on that we don't know.

So there's three main characters...I'm starting to think there might not be that much bayo dialogue.
You gotta remember that Hale was directly thrown under the bus by Taylor in her videos. I can't imagine she's happy about being told 'you have no right to voice Bayonetta'.
 

Styner

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True, true, personally I think there's something more going with this whole situation something we're missing. Something Platinum and Her don't want to share publicly.

She had a whole year to say this and yet she chooses a couple of weeks before the the release date to mention it?

Don't get me wrong, but September of last year we knew bayo had a new VA, we didn't know who it was, but we knew it wasn't her, why now all of a sudden is she calling out platinum games and the offer they gave her.
 

Halo

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So the $4k the Bayo VA was offered was presumably going to be for 4 4 hour sessions meaning she would have been paid like $250 an hour
 

Bep

varishangout.com
I think Hellena Taylor is in the wrong EITHER WAY. She's a literal nobody, whos voice we ONLY know as Bayonetta, and as far as I know, has done fuck all in the years between Bayonetta 2 and 3.

4k, depending on how many sessions it was asked of her to work, is either at scale, or better than scale, according to VA who has been active since at least like 2008?
1665987132834.png


1665987438112.png



Same thing from a different VA who did voices for BotW and (Hyrule warriors I'm assuming)
1665987593294.png



Jennifer Hale, who is an actual pro in the industry, was almost certainly MORE expensive to hire than Taylor.

Tweet seems to include rates for VAs, indicating that this was in fact a standard offer.

1665987950760.png

FfN2fU9XoAARdjt
 

Styner

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4k, depending on how many sessions it was asked of her to work, is either at scale, or better than scale, according to VA who has been active since at least like 2008?
Given the fact there's 3(potentially) Main characters in this one bayo, Jeanne(At least one mission) and Viola it wouldn't be surprising if bayo has less dialogue in this one compared to the others.
 

Styner

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Hale officially responded and its the most industry standard answer.

For someone who apparently fought for VA rights and better pay its a weird ass way of handling it.

Tweet (Archive)
 

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YakuInTheFlesh

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Hale officially responded and its the most industry standard answer.

For someone who apparently fought for VA rights and better pay its a weird ass way of handling it.

Tweet (Archive)
"My reputation speaks for itself". I would argue 999 out of 1000 people don't give a shit about VAs.

Honestly the west has shot itself in the foot on this one. VAs are extremely replaceable, since most of them have no face attached. Go on twitter and you'll find plenty of people who would love to break into the business and take peanuts for it. This is not Japan where Seyuus do more than just provide a voice. Being able to sing is often enough a criteria and some even border on full-on Idols.

If the information is true then 250$/hr is insane and it's purely your fault if you expect that this one job will pay until the next one. I hope the new VA will get some great deals out of this gig in the future!
 

Styner

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If the information is true then 250$/hr is insane
Appearantly the 250$/hr is the non union rate. Both are in a union so the minimum for an hour is 451$ but she's gone on record to say she usually has the 4 hour session stuff with platinum which is 1000$ per 4 hours per day.

So that means they offered her 16 hours worth of pay up front, mind you she openly has admitted bayonetta 2 only took 16 hours to record So she got paid that much for bayo 2 going by her words bayo 2 earned her 4000$.

And she is in a union. Same one as Hale.
 

YakuInTheFlesh

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Appearantly the 250$/hr is the non union rate. Both are in a union so the minimum for an hour is 451$ but she's gone on record to say she usually has the 4 hour session stuff with platinum which is 1000$ per 4 hours per day.

So that means they offered her 16 hours worth of pay up front, mind you she openly has admitted bayonetta 2 only took 16 hours to record So she got paid that much for bayo 2 going by her words bayo 2 earned her 4000$.

And she is in a union. Same one as Hale.
I really don't see the problem that she has. If she accepted this before then she shouldn't be surprised if she gets the same this time...
 

Styner

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I'm guessing she wanted royalties as well, given how she claims she is bayonetta.

But that's just speculation, tbh we don't know why she's doing this, she's got twitter on her side, but legally I don't think she has a leg to stand on if platinum were to sue for defamation, she was offered the same amount as before possibly for less work given that the higher offer was 4000$
 
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Halo

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New info from Blomberg suggesting the 4k was per session and she was offered 5 sessions documentation appearantly has been seen by blomberg. (As much as I hate Jason, this is certainly valid information.)
this isn't new, people in the thread already said this?
 
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